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F8x CCB front 6 pots / M2 2NH 6 pots on F2x / F3x / E8x chassis

15K views 34 replies 10 participants last post by  R99 
#1 ·
Hi all.

I'll start by saying I know this is not a straight swap and this will be on a F31. However, as we all know, if it can be done on F3x then by default it would also work with E8x, E9x, F2x etc too.

I have a pair of F8x CCB gold 6 pots. No pads & no discs.

Following a read here:
It seems that the incoming M2 competition will be using the identical front calipers for the 2NH braking upgrade - albeit with more realistically priced iron discs & conventional pads.

My thoughts are to obtain the M2 competition 400mm rotors & pads and find somewhere to machine some new radial mounts for the 6 pots to suit F3x hubs.

Should be much easier with radial mounted calipers rather than axial mounted to obtain the correct spacing with a new custom bracket.

Would be interested to hear people's thoughts on this?
 
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#2 ·
F8x CCB calipers arrived today, some comparison shots vs OEM F30 370mm blue brembo:









OEM F30 brake hose and caliper bolts work fine:



The vision is to have the same set up as this:

 
#3 ·
I got prices today for the front discs & pads. Dealer states they can have them next week.

Front discs = £248 each
Front pads = £355
Total = £851

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#4 ·
Updates so far...

I have now found out that the M2 Competition, like the F10 M5, has two pad options for these calipers.

Stock: 34112284869
Optional accessory 'Sport': 34112284465

When ordered with the grey 6 pots from factory, you get the stock pads. When buying the 6 pots from the dealer accessory catalogue, you get the 'Sport' pads.

I've now bought the stock pads, at a much more reasonable £190. Just the discs left to source now once they are available in mid August.

With regards to brake pedal, the info from Racing Brake has covered that off - it will be the same as stock.

racingbrake said:
You are basically swapping the original blue 4/2 pot to gold 6/4 pot calipers just like upgrading to other aftermarket brake kits. In other words, it shall not relate to CCB system.

For your information, here is the piston size and front/rear area ratio:

CCB (gold) brake calipers:

Front 6 pistons: 30/34/36mm = 52.7 cm^2 (68%)
Rear 4 pistons: 28/28mm = 24.6 cm^2 (32%)
Total: 77.4 cm^2

Iron (blue) brake calipers:

Front 4 pistons: 40/40mm = 50.3 cm^2 (67%)
Rear 2 pisotns: 40mm cm = 25.1 cm^2 (33%)
Total: 75.4 cm^2

Total piston area and F/R ratio are almost identical on both set up, so we see no reason to be even concerned on brake bias due to this upgrade, while it might be worthwhile for you to check aftermarket brake kits that you are considering before you purchase.
I have also sourced a set of F10 M5 6 pots too - which has a 5mm shorter mounting point, plus the removal of titanium pistons, which the CCB calipers have:



I will be getting brackets made for both sets of calipers so that it leaves options open for people wishing to follow suit as F10 M5 calipers are far easier to source on the used market than F8x CCB's!

I will also be working with the company doing the work to engineer a radial bracket for the F10 M5 calipers which is identical to the radial bracket on the CCB caliper (+5mm) so that the F10 M5 caliper can become P&P for the F8x chassis with the use of the M2 Comp 400mm discs...

Updates will follow!

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#7 ·
THETYRANT said:
Monster caliper these :), have you got the new pads as curious to see if same as above..

Ian
Pads arrive this week / beginning of next.

I'll post pics when they arrive, but they are just stock F10 M5 pads.

Yeh, the size is crazy when you see them side by side!

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#8 ·
R99 said:
THETYRANT said:
Monster caliper these :), have you got the new pads as curious to see if same as above..

Ian
Pads arrive this week / beginning of next.

I'll post pics when they arrive, but they are just stock F10 M5 pads.

Yeh, the size is crazy when you see them side by side!

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Nice one will drop you a pm as ive a favour to ask :D

First time i saw the F10 M5 pads i was shocked at size for a OEM pad and we already see some big brake setups here :D

Ian
 
#9 ·
The blue M5 / M6 6 pots turned up today - couple of comparison shots - the gold definitely makes these calipers stand out / look bigger compared to the blue!

Some shots showing the 5mm mounting point difference, as detailed previously, again a stock 4 pot for size comparison:











Also a couple of shots showing differences between OEM F10 M5 brake hoses and OEM F30 hoses - I need to check out the F3x / F8x hoses that are fitted from factory on cars optioned with CCB's. If its the same as the F10 ones with the small metal input section then I will factor those into the conversion too.



 
#10 ·
Good project but may not be a cake-walk.

Sub'd as am curious about a set of the m5 blue calipers fitting front of m2 with thicker 370-380 discs.



Looking at yr photo above - the oem adaptor bracket looks like it has enough meat on the mount flanges to reduce its height (similar to mount lugs between blue and gold calipers) TP suit a smaller disc diameter
 
#11 ·
Blind Pugh said:
Good project but may not be a cake-walk.

Sub'd as am curious about a set of the m5 blue calipers fitting front of m2 with thicker 370-380 discs.



Looking at yr photo above - the oem adaptor bracket looks like it has enough meat on the mount flanges to reduce its height (similar to mount lugs between blue and gold calipers) TP suit a smaller disc diameter
I'm fairly confident it will work without issues as I have a F30 hub to mount it all up on & the measurements & brackets will be done by a professional outfit that only does this exact work.

I'm not quite sure I know what you mean about the mount flanges? Are you talking about machining material off the calipers?

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#12 ·
R99 said:


I'm not quite sure I know what you mean about the mount flanges? Are you talking about machining material off the calipers?
My reference to mount flanges was on silver adapter bracket where it meets gold caliper in photo above. You could perhaps remove 5mm thickness of each silver mount flange provides adapter doesn't foul on the caliper
 
#13 ·
Blind Pugh said:
R99 said:


I'm not quite sure I know what you mean about the mount flanges? Are you talking about machining material off the calipers?
My reference to mount flanges was on silver adapter bracket where it meets gold caliper in photo above. You could perhaps remove 5mm thickness of each silver mount flange provides adapter doesn't foul on the caliper
Ah, yes I understand you now.

The 5mm doesn't affect me for F3x use, as custom radial brackets are going to be built for each caliper version.

Then for M2 / M3 & M4 owners, a copy of the silver bracket will be made (+the extra 5mm) so that the blue F10 M5 calipers can be made to work on F8x chassis with the 400mm discs.

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#14 ·
R99 said:
Blind Pugh said:
R99 said:


I'm not quite sure I know what you mean about the mount flanges? Are you talking about machining material off the calipers?
My reference to mount flanges was on silver adapter bracket where it meets gold caliper in photo above. You could perhaps remove 5mm thickness of each silver mount flange provides adapter doesn't foul on the caliper
Ah, yes I understand you now.

The 5mm doesn't affect me for F3x use, as custom radial brackets are going to be built for each caliper version.

Then for M2 / M3 & M4 owners, a copy of the silver bracket will be made (+the extra 5mm) so that the blue F10 M5 calipers can be made to work on F8x chassis with the 400mm discs.
Understood - I'm wanting to add 6 pot calipers but keep them 18" wheel compatible so 400mm discs no good for me.
 
#15 ·
Blind Pugh said:
R99 said:
Blind Pugh said:
My reference to mount flanges was on silver adapter bracket where it meets gold caliper in photo above. You could perhaps remove 5mm thickness of each silver mount flange provides adapter doesn't foul on the caliper
Ah, yes I understand you now.

The 5mm doesn't affect me for F3x use, as custom radial brackets are going to be built for each caliper version.

Then for M2 / M3 & M4 owners, a copy of the silver bracket will be made (+the extra 5mm) so that the blue F10 M5 calipers can be made to work on F8x chassis with the 400mm discs.
Understood - I'm wanting to add 6 pot calipers but keep them 18" wheel compatible so 400mm discs no good for me.
I see! I think the problem is the pad size that these calipers use isn't compatible with anything smaller than 390-410mm

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#16 ·
A further update, my spare hub arrived & curiosity got the better of me, so I mounted a 370mm 4 pot caliper on vs a 400mm 6 pot CCB caliper:

Kind of irrelevant until I see the hat height / offset of the M2 competition 400mm rotors.

However, the caliper position seems pretty similar.





I did encounter the first issue though, and that is that the OEM CCB radial bracket does not bolt flush into a F3x hub. This will be replaced anyway via a custom radial mount...



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#18 ·
Work has started on the brackets & I will also be exploring the possibility of a bracket to facilitate the use of the 370mm ///M disc on the rear too

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#19 ·
Just to come back to this one, the brackets are now made!

The brackets are designed for use with the following:

F10 M5 6 pot caliper body
F10 M5 / M2 2NH pads
M2 2NH 400mm brake discs

Test fit on my own car is the next step, which hopefully will be quite soon! :)
 
#22 ·
This is really cool, nice work.

I'd be interested in doing this but only have 18s so wouldn't be able to fit 400mm discs :cry:
 
#23 ·
AidanZ130 said:
This is really cool, nice work.

I'd be interested in doing this but only have 18s so wouldn't be able to fit 400mm discs :cry:
Yeh, you'd need 19" minimum for the 400mm discs!

Shame, as it will be a very capable kit!
 
#25 ·
OK, so finally I can update this..... with the results of my ongoing brake project in conjunction with Vagbremtechnic

To confirm, this is a pair of F10 M5 6 pot calipers fitted onto F3x chassis with a custom radial bracket. Pads are genuine BMW M5 items, and the discs are M2 Competition 400mm.

Pedal feel is fine, and the brakes have only done 150 miles so far, so are still being bedded in, but initial feel is very good.

Pics:









 
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